ubuntugeek Alrightly folks shall we get started? Rocket2DMn how long do these meetings usually last? ubuntugeek https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ForumCouncilAgenda forumsmatthew let's get started Rocket2DMn is kiwi showing up? ubuntugeek First up.. Policies and future of OMGPP forum edavidburg Aha. nathangrubb edavidburg: pay attention edavidburg I am ubuntugeek There has been discussion about the OMGPP forum as of late, controversy etc. The question stands do we need a forum like this in UF. edavidburg I think it helps the feel of a community forumsmatthew I was one of the primary proponents of creating the section when we started it forumsmatthew I am not so sure now edavidburg But there are alternatives to hosting is on UF.org.... *cough* ubuntugeek Take into consideration that the OMGPP takes alot of resources and doesn't really represent what the forum is about. We have a general cafe area for off-topic stuff. forumsmatthew The cafe is important, I think, because we are more than a mere tech support forum, we are a community ubuntugeek edavidburg: that is correct nathangrubb ubuntugeek: the cafe seems to be more geared towards linux forumsmatthew but, we have prioritized the tech side forumsmatthew and that needs to be the focal point of our time and energies forumsmatthew while supporting community ubuntugeek forumsmatthew: correct forumsmatthew the cafe doesn't have to be linux related, just light hearted and not really controversial Rocket2DMn OPP takes a lot of time to moderate and much of the crowd that hands out there is not participating in the rest of the forum regularly. They tend to be a small, but very vocal porition of the forum community. When issues are reported and infractions are issued, it seems that more often than not they take their problems to the Res. Center, unlike users in the rest of the forum who simply adjust and move on. edavidburg I would be willing to take on some of that responsibility Rocket2DMn "free speech" seems to be a major issue, and it is difficult for the volunteering moderators to determine where to draw the line on agression in OPP ubuntugeek Rocket2DMN Joeb454 free speech can never exist on a moderated forum, I think some people have trouble understanding that Joeb454 hi by the way :) ubuntugeek You are right, it would be alot easier if the forums turned its focus to the technical aspects of the distro then catering to a small portion of people who want to be controversial. nathangrubb hey Joeb454, and yes, people in OMGPP seem to complain alot in the res center Technoviking maybe we should state once a thread is closed in OMGPP it will not be re-opened forumsmatthew We have had to revisit the rules and moderation of this section of the forums numerous times. We have tried a lot of things. I'm out of ideas ubuntugeek I am going to propose that we shutdown the OMGPP forum, we will leave the cafe open and it will continue to provide a general off-topic non-contraversial area for discussion. I think we will have no problem providing a few links to other forums that are in the nature of the OMGPP for a short period of time. p_quarles Joeb454: the issue is less one of free speech than one of perceived "fairness" -- this is where people begin to feel slighted, rightly or wrongly, and what has been incredibly difficult to address in a way that satisfies anyone edavidburg Technoviking: then what's the point of the Res center? Rocket2DMn I'm glad you agree. From a personal standpoint, when I was invited to help moderate the forums, I hopped on board to hel pkeep the Ubuntu Forums running smoothly, not to moderate poliitcal/religious/etc arguments nathangrubb edavidburg: the res center isn't just for omgpp Technoviking edavidburg: for problem in the other areas of the forums forumsmatthew ubuntugeek, I am going to support the idea forumsmatthew the Res Center is designed to be a place to deal with issues from the entire forums community, not just one section forumsmatthew it has been used, effectively, by people who have had legitimate complaints on many occasions edavidburg like me :) ubuntugeek As of late the OMGPP forum has kind of overrun the res center. Rocket2DMn I was originally in favor of simply adjusting OPP to be more professional through changing the name, ditching the text color, and adjusting the rules, but it seems that any incarnation of the backyward/OPP is going to create problems forumsmatthew it has simply been used a lot more because of drama from OMGPP Technoviking i do feel if OMGPP closed down, the tome of the cafe and other areas will change for the worse edavidburg Technoviking: I think if there were offsite links to help the transtition that would be minimized ubuntugeek technoviking: probably, but we will make adjustments and people will need to understand forumsmatthew Technoviking, I share the concern, but in those areas we have clear rules as to what is and is not permissible, and rules that are not as easily argued about "but, this means..." ubuntugeek edavidburg: exactly nathangrubb and there are already many omgpp regulars on nomgpp p_quarles Technoviking: that is why I think we need to make certains topics (e.g., my religion is better than yours) 100% off limits p_quarles I think that much of the discontent we moderators face is directly related to the fact that people are allowed to start such topics, but have to be exceedingly careful about stepping on anyone's toes -- and we the staff don't have any kind of objective distance on those issues Technoviking I also feel that OMGPP may have need to go, but I feel there will be backlash forumsmatthew in the cafe, we can say a clear "no religious discussions" rule. Politics will be a little more difficult and we will need to discuss how to deal with that ubuntugeek technoviking: Change is good, people will adapt forumsmatthew many things in the FOSS world revolve around political discussions and opinions forumsmatthew even so, I think we can adapt ubuntugeek forumsmatthew: agreed forumsmatthew and the political stuff has been less divisive typically nathangrubb +1 forumsmatthew p_quarles forumsmatthew: I agree; personally, I would encourage a policy of "politics related to tech? yes; politics of the Iraq war? no" forumsmatthew especially if we prohibit discussions of specific elections, national politics, etc, and keep the political discussions more broad ubuntugeek p_quarles: i'll go along with that edavidburg forumsmatthew: +1 Joeb454 I'd like OMGPP to stay, but I also support closing it * jacob (i=jacob@ubuntu/member/jacob) has joined #ubuntu-meeting nathangrubb hey jacob Joeb454 or will the cafe become an off-topic area for anything within reason? jacob hey nathangrubb (/me sneaks in late) ubuntugeek The proposal is we will close the OMGPP forum on Oct 1, we will allow no religious topics in the cafe, political discussions need to be related to technical discussions. And we will provide links to a couple forums that relate to the OMGPP for 2 weeks. nathangrubb Joeb454: well forumsmatthew said 'light hearted discussions', so Joeb454 ubuntugeek, seems fair enough forumsmatthew I think we will need to discuss topics that would be reasonable for the cafe in a little more detail, but something like "try to keep it fun and lighthearted" would be a good baseline ubuntugeek +1 edavidburg ubuntugeek: +1 Joeb454 +1 scaredpoet +1 forumsmatthew ubuntugeek, +1 nathangrubb +1 Rocket2DMn +1 Joeb454 forumsmatthew, I think some of the OK (I admit it's not many) threads from OMGPP should be allowed in the revised cafe xhhux +1 Joeb454 i.e. the recent thread about the ill cat Technoviking +1 forumsmatthew Joeb454, maybe. Instead of moving them, members could just restart as needed nathangrubb +1 Joeb454 I think that was quite a nice story and it had a lot of people talking, in an amicable manner * jdong (n=dizzle@ubuntu/member/jdong) has joined #ubuntu-meeting Joeb454 forumsmatthew, that's what I meant forumsmatthew Is there anyone opposed? Joeb454 I didn't know how to word it though nathangrubb hey jacob edavidburg jdong: you're late jdong ack look who got sidetracked... nathangrubb er tab complete fail nathangrubb I meant jdong ubuntugeek Great, we have a decision. Matthew since you are so elegant with your words would you like to make the post about OMGPP closing on Oct1 forumsmatthew I can do that. It might even get posted later today ubuntugeek Thanks ubuntugeek I brought John up to speed on the proposal jdong sorry for coming in late; for the record I'm also +1 on the proposal jdong thanks ubuntugeek for filling me in ubuntugeek Shall we move on to the next item?